This is the transcript from a recent interview with Dr. Kaplan, in a recent interview about the Leading with Heart tenet, Humility.
Interviewer: I know one of your tenants, and leading with heart is humility. So, talk to me about that. What does that mean for a leader to be humble?
Jeff: It’s not about you! The decisions that you make, what you say, even your approach to problems and people is based on the organization’s mission. You are making decisions for what is best for the company, Not you. That is it. I mean, I think when you are not humble, you very much get in your way because it is all about you, how you look, what’s in it for you, and the impact of decisions on you personally.
Interviewer: well, often, you know, leaders will link their identity, which is associated with the organization. So, even if they are trying to generate revenue or progress metrics for the business, they are doing it for their best interest. Still, there is more to it, being humble and having humility in terms of leadership. It’s not so much just about business metrics, but about interactions with your staff, giving credit to people in public, things like that. What else is there that people should be aware of when it comes to humility?
Jeff: Well, the last one about giving credit to others is a good example. So, you know, some people are very high in the need for recognition, meaning that they need to be recognized themselves. That’s fine, but you’re willing to share the credit when you are low on the need for recognition. You know, somewhere in the middle is helpful; you believe that achievement is important to be recognized, but it’s imperative to share the credit and recognize others. So, your job is to motivate and influence others for the good of the business. It’s quite frankly much easier to do that when it’s not “the you” show, you know.” When it is about the work and the mission and the customers you are serving, that is the North Star! Quite frankly, if someone is narcissistic or just completely lacks humility, they see themselves as the North Star.
You have two extremes of how they can look bad; one extreme is you have a mutiny on one hand where people push back against the leader because s/he is more focused on the mission. On the other hand, you have employees blindly following the leader. At the extreme, it’s a cult, where this is blind obedience and no push back. At the very least, this leads to very poor decisions.
Interviewer: I like that a lot because what you are saying is that humility is about that North Star. What is the North Star? Is it you? Or is it something bigger than you? Because people will follow you if it is something bigger than you? I mean, they will follow you in some cases, even if it’s just you, but in most cases, it’s because there’s a cause that’s bigger.
Jeff: You know what it is? It’s when you lack humility, and you can fall easily into a trap. You are making decisions, problem-solving and interacting, but if it is all about you, there will be moments where you are challenged. What is the right thing to do here? And if the ego is leading the way, you can end up down a path that is, at minimum, not good for the business. You could lose good people, and you make poor decisions; you could lose money, lose customers, and all kinds of negative things. But if your North Star is the customers and the organization’s mission and others before you, that is a sustainable solution.
Interviewer: There’s part two to this question. Part two is as a leader; how do you know if you’re not being humble?
Jeff: Well, A). people tell you, and B) if they don’t get a 360-assessment done, you’ll find out. You know, hire an excellent executive coach or consultant and have them do a 360. It’s a fair question because fewer people give you honest feedback when you’re high up the corporate ladder. You have an incomplete picture of the business and its people. In fact, when other people confront you, you often see them as attacking you, rather than simply just challenging a decision that they don’t think is the right decision for the company. It creates a lot of internal conflict.
Interviewer: Yeah, but you can lose good people that way, or you might feel like, oh, they are not a cultural fit for my company, and then you get rid of them or something.
Jeff: It is hard to work with a narcissist, and I keep saying a narcissist is the opposite of humility because, quite frankly, that is what it is.
Interviewer: If you are humble, it doesn’t mean you are only humble, but you are humble and at the same time continue directing and leading because you also need to influence, support, motivate and develop. You pull people together. We need to be directing people and holding them accountable. When you need to hold people accountable, the difference is it Not about you. It’s about what’s right for the organization. Here is another reason why you humilities important; if you’re low in the ranks and you’re not good at let’s say, asserting yourself and you need to assert yourself for a decision, that is the right decision for the organization, but it is also good for you.
(Here is another reason why humility is essential; if you’re low in the ranks and, for example, are weak at asserting yourself, and you need to assert yourself for a decision, and it’s the right decision for the organization, but it is also good for you).
So, I give me more scope of responsibilities, and it’s so much easier to make that argument when you’ve consistently been arguing for what’s right for the organization, even if at times it may not be the best for you. So when that time comes that it’s also best for you, people are more likely to believe you; they will see you’re advocating for a decision because it’s right for the organization, even if it’s also right for you. And we will end up there.
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